TRF, How big is too big?

[Zardoz]

I posted about this topic in the another thread, but maybe it needs it's own discussion...

I guess I shouldn't complain about the success of my home faire, but I recall Highland Saturday last year, shouldering through like 34,000 people by lunch time; I'm not Agoraphobic at all, but I just wanted out of there.
Those crazy big attendance numbers, and the packed lanes in the faire and roads trying to get out are why I show up before cannon and leave by 3 o'clock or so lately, or only come up on Sundays. But last Sunday's (11/21) numbers were like a busy Saturday anyway. I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels this way, and I wonder if it could affect attendance in the future?

5 or 6 years ago a "busy" Saturday was 19-20,000 folks and the faire had like 260,000 total over the 7 weekends. Based on that, the powers that be thought the faire could support an extra weekend.

The second year after the 8th weekend was added, 2006, totals were over 300,000 and have risen steadily every year, to almosr 450,000 in 2009.

And if 8th weekend 2010 is like last year, I think it's safe to say we're looking at total of over 470,000 +/- folks this year.


  I wonder if a 9th weekend is in the cards soon? Discuss...

[The Rabbi]

     It is safe to say that TRF is now without a doubt not on my list of fairs to go to no disrespect intended. I think it is great that TRF is doing so well but I am not a fan of Huge Fairs. It has been my experience that at some point the fair reaches the point of an amusement park and the guest are nothing more then rubes at a carnival. I like smaller fairs where the vendors and cast are able to spend time with each other and the paying guest. I would be happy to see 2000 guest in one weekend at our fest but think even then there might be much lost in the crowd. My opinion here would be to find a way to break off and form another fair it is apparent that the attendance indicates that it would support the cause. Even if it was the owners of TRF that did so. I wish nothing but the best for TRF and hope their success continues but I have much empathy for you in dealing with the crowds. 

[Laird Fraser of Lovatt]

I was there, on the Saturday in question, last year.... and it was a mad house.  I've NEVER seen a crowd quite like that before at TRF... 

[LadyJessica]

Honestly I do not really like big crowds and have been wondering the same thing Zardoz.  Well that and it would be easier to remember that TRF runs every weekend in Oct and Nov than to remember that it's 8 weekends with the final weekend on Thanksgiving.  I thought that they would have done that after the first Thansgiving weekend.

But, I really don't know how the vendors would take having to be there another weekend.

[Singed]

According to the Beefeater's site, Sunday's gate was 28,063 which put it about on par with most Saturdays this year.  The other thing is that people stayed late, we stuck around and finished a project after cannon, closed down the forge and had an extended bull session and there was still a mob of patrons working their way out of the gate when we walked to participants camp and a massive backup heading towards Magnolia.

I'm not complaining of course, but it was certainly a weird Sunday.  

[Singed]

I don't think adding another weekend will thin the ranks out at all, the attendance numbers at http://trfbeefeaters.com/records.php don't really show a dip when the transition was made from 7 to 8 weekends, there is no real reason to believe that there would be one from 8 to 9.  I kind of like the big crowds but since I get there Friday night and leave well after cannon on Sunday I'm not really affected by the traffic, I can easily see where it is a problem for some. 

As a non-paid person who "works" there (it can't be work, I enjoy it too much).  I'm already pushing things at 8 weekends, paying for gas, food, and dog sitting, being gone every weekend, etc.  I am lucky in that I'm somewhat local (50 miles), I'm not sure how many people in my position could easily handle a 9th weekend. 

By week 8, we are absolutely spent, behind on a lot of mundane tasks that we would normally do on weekends, and generally ready for TRF to wrap up for the year.  Of course we are usually missing our friends, making plans, looking forward to next season and watching the countdown by mid-December or early January. 

[raevyncait]

I'm not sure that running another weekend after Thanksgiving would necessarily be a smart thing to do, as generally the following weekend is Dickens on The Strand down in Galveston, which draws a fair amount of Faire Folk, or so it seems to me, anyway, I always see more people that I at least recognize from Scarby and/or TRF.

That being said, I know that the crowds are part of the reason I don't make time and find funds to go to TRF more often. It's just too many people, many of whom are too drunk to be even reasonably courteous, and simply want to act like idiots.

[Merlin the Elder]

When I first saw one of the Ren mags, it was showing TRF with an annual of 750,000 (this was quite some time back). From what I've seen on the Beefeaters site, that may very well have been very wishful thinking. But that same mag also showed Scarborough at 250k, and thinking back, I'm not sure I can even come close to believing that. Does anyone know the current Scarby annuals?

It's been a very long time since I went to TRF, maybe 20 years or so. Admittedly, we were only there for part of a day, but it was way too much to see and do for a one-day excursion back then. Scarborough, on the other hand, can almost be done in a day, if you push it. But either one needs at least two days for a comfortable experience.  Until I've been here on R/F, I haven't had that much interest in branching out, but I need to meet some of you lunatics.     But I do realize now that to do one of the larger faires, you almost have to do two days to do it justice.

I'm one of those that prefers quality to quantity. If you can maintain the quality of the experience in a faire the size of TRF, then it isn't too big. If the quality is suffering—the ratio of mundanes to cast or good playtrons is too small—then the faire is too big. In the long run, it would probably ruin the faire.

So—you regulars—how is the quality holding up?

[angusmacinnes]

I made Halloween and Highland Fling weekends this year.  Something I have done since 2005.  Yes their were massive crowds and with the exception of only 2 extremely drunk patrons , which neither were being obnoxious, I did not witness anyone being out of line, which I have witnessed in the past.  I dont really see a 9th weekend being needed and I know that after 8 weeks all the cast and crew are ready for a break.  This years TRF was a good one.

[Laird Fraser of Lovatt]

This was probably the funniest time i've had IN TRF.  The Dane's seemed to be more interactive with the playtrons and the only obnoxious ones were to be found out in camp... even those weren't all THAT bad.  I never have a schedule to follow, so my brother & I wandered to our hearts content and ran across some of the most interesting types....

[Merlin the Elder]

Well, at least from you two, Angus and Fraser, it hasn't gotten too big yet!

[Xantrawler]

My opinion? Well, if you have enough room and a big enough cast then this size isn't bad. If you don't have enough room or a small cast then I can see a problem. Too small of a space and people get squeezed in and you are running into each other or stepping on someone so on and so forth. Tempers become short and it is no longer fun. If the cast is not large enough then they can't interact efficiently with the patrons and the patrons start to feel, well not ignored but not as welcomed. You start to see it on the cast face as well as they become wore out. Yes you can have an event that is too big. It sounds like TRF has got there and I don't know if I would want to go. I'm sure they do a wonderful job but I am not one for really big crowds. I don't have an answer as far as what can be done, because if you start to limit the number of people allowed in you kill your faire and you don't want that.

[eldatari]

I have been going to TRF since '99.  Yes there have been some changes through the years that I haven't been pleased with, but there are far more good things about the fair.  I have been to six different fairs since I started going and TRF is by far my favorite!!  TRF is not to big and if you have never been it is defiantly worth trying at least once, it is wonder to behold.

[Fenster]

I agree that even with the large crowds i've witnessed very few "crazies" this season.  Living so close the large size is nice as each weekend we can see something we missed the previous time out. 

[Delireus]

I use to go 3 or 4 times a season in high school but now, being away for college, I am lucky to go once during the Thanksgiving break. I went last sunday (11/21) and it took us an hour to get from our parking space to the light in Plantersville. I'm not very good with directions, but its the light right by the train tracks. Then it's another hour to get home, so gah, traffic was crazy.

Thankfully, I'm going again this Saturday before flying back to school, exciting! I love how big TRF is, though I get agitated when I don't get there at cannon with friends because I hate to miss anything. I almost went crazy when my family and I left the house at 11 to make the hour drive to faire. I don't see as many shows as I'd like to, but I love going to see all the vendors. I've never had a bad experience with any patrons, though this last trip something bad went down with a merchant, but that didn't damper my time there at all. The big size is also great because there is always something new to discover every time, though I know that's true with any size faire as well. Forever, Ill always compare every faire I go to back to TRF, it's my most favorite place on earth